Believe in People: Addiction, Recovery & Stigma
2024 British Podcast Award Winner & Radio Academy Award Nominated Podcast
Believe in People explores addiction, recovery and stigma with different people.
If you or someone you know is struggling with addiction then this podcast can help.
Believe in People: Addiction, Recovery & Stigma
#43 - Amy Jo Johnson: Alcohol Free & Loving Life
Matt is in conversation with Amy Jo Johnson; actress, singer, writer and filmmaker best known for her role as the original Pink Ranger, in the worldwide hit 90's television series Mighty Morphin Power Rangers.
Together, they delve into Amy Jo's decision to abstain from alcohol, viewing it not as an obligation but as an empowering choice that has fundamentally reshaped her life.
Amy Jo's narrative encompasses her upbringing in a religious cult, her father's battle with alcoholism, and the profound impact of these experiences on her life's trajectory.
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Believe in People explores addiction, recovery and stigma.
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We'd like to extend our heartfelt thanks to Christopher Tait of the band Belle Ghoul & Electric Six for allowing us to use the track Jonathan Tortoise. Thank you, Chris, for being a part of this journey with us.
This is a renew original recording. Hello and welcome to the Believe in People podcast. My name is Matthew Butler and I'm your host, or, as I like to say, your facilitator. Today, we're in conversation with Amy Jo Johnson, actress, singer, writer and filmmaker best known for her role as the original Pink Ranger in the worldwide hit 90s television series Mighty Morphin Power Rangers. Together, we delve into Amy Jo's decision to abstain from alcohol, viewing it not as an obligation but as an empowering choice that has fundamentally reshaped her life. Amy Jo's narrative encompasses her upbringing in a religious cult, her father's battle with alcoholism and the profound impact of these experiences on her life's trajectory. Amy Jo, thank you so much for joining us on the Believe in People podcast. First of all, how are you?
Speaker 2:I'm okay, I'm okay 'm okay, I'm. You know, we're in aberdeen right now, right, and so I have a little bit of jet lag, mixed with the full moon, mixed with too much information, menopause and I am, so I've just found myself very spacey and emotional all day, so if I cry, I apologize, no, don't.
Speaker 1:You wouldn't be the first person to cry on this podcast.
Speaker 2:Don't worry about that yeah, yeah, yeah, especially with the subject matter.
Speaker 1:Yeah, of course, yeah, yeah. How was the convention?
Speaker 2:It was fun. It was you know it was, maybe you don't know it was. Everybody was super sweet and very nice and, um, it was. And I got to see a really good friend of mine that I haven't seen, oh my gosh, in almost 20 years. Her name is tea. I met her. She's from bosnia and she lives in scotland now and she came and she assisted me at the convention. It was pretty cool. I hadn't seen her in forever yeah, I met her when she was a child wow, yeah.
Speaker 1:So yeah, that would have been quite fun 20 years later to see them again.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I used to go to the first time I went. I went as a volunteer for this summer camp in 1998, um and I met her little sister and then we fell in love. She's like a soul sister. And then I just kept coming back um to bosnia like six times and just fell in love with their family. And then I've just finally reconnected with Taya, anyway.
Speaker 1:Nice, this is really nice, lovely stuff. So April 28th, you are two years sober on that day, is that right?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean sober. I don't know that's such a heavy loaded word for me.
Speaker 1:It is quite a loaded word for people. Yeah, For me it.
Speaker 2:It's been two years since I decided I don't want to drink anymore. And it's my choice and at any point I could change my mind if I wanted to and I think that's helpful for me. Yes, because I have no desire and it sort of gives me the control.
Speaker 2:I feel as well, and it has been almost two years. May 23rd is the day that I was like I'm done and I feel like, within those two years, the confidence within even talking about that is now really because I'm so comfortable with not drinking now. It's such a part of my life now that I, I, um, I, I, I, yeah. I guess I just have more confidence around that, like the first year it was like I don't want to talk about it because I don't want to disappoint maybe myself or somebody else, or, but now I, I have absolutely no interest.
Speaker 1:it's good to say that about the label, though because I, I too, found that when I attach a label to something, it becomes really hard to do. Here in the uk we have a annual campaign called dry january where people give up alcohol for a month. I probably do that subconsciously a lot, but if I say to myself I'm going to do dry january, all I will want is to, I'll probably get cravings to have an alcoholic drink. Yeah, so the label of it of saying I'm doing this or I'm committing to this, I found that quite hard. So it's nice that you have that, the flippancy that you could you know yeah.
Speaker 2:So that was advice given to me from a mentor of mine. His name is robert, but when I first decided to quit two years ago, I was really struggling for the first maybe three weeks and I actually called him and I was just like, not that I wanted a drink, but it was just like almost like a mind fuck happening for me. And I called him and I'm like I'm driving myself crazy. He goes well, what is it? And I was like I just I, you know, I say I'm not going to drink anymore. But it's like it's making me crazy. And and he said, then go have a drink. You're allowed to go have a drink. And I was like, but I don't want one.
Speaker 2:He goes great yeah, now it's been I don't even want one, and he's like yeah, so just tell yourself you can, but you just don't want one. So that works for me and it has worked good.
Speaker 1:Um, at the one year mark, you decided to share a profound statement that reached hundreds of thousands, if not millions. Um, I'm gonna read it out, actually, because I've got it here. It says here a year ago, I found myself struggling to stay okay. I was perpetually depressed, I had anxiety and it was scaring the shit out of me. I knew I needed to blow something up in my life. I knew I needed a drastic change. So, instead of breaking up with my sweet boyfriend, I decided to leave an old friend called alcohol. Can you share any insights into the mindset when you wrote that social media post detailing your decision to leave alcohol behind and, I suppose, the liberating journey of sobriety and it initiated beyond what you've said already?
Speaker 2:yeah, so that was a year after I I had decided to stop drinking and I felt comfortable enough to talk about it on social media. Within that, you know and I did that because I tell you that whole first year I would find myself on social media searching for other people who had stopped- and. I found that really inspiring. When I hear Drew Barrymore talk about it, it really inspires me.
Speaker 2:Um yeah, so I've I decided to just do that because I know how much it meant to me when I would see other people that had decided to stop that weren't necessarily hit rock bottom or necessarily um you know alcoholics or or whatever you know Soics, or whatever you know, so I just thought, why not share that? Maybe?
Speaker 1:it will inspire somebody, yeah absolutely, and you've got such a you know large social media following. You have such profile and influence that people will look to you and seeing you go through that, like you've said, I'm sure will help plenty of other people as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and you know, and the funny thing is is like hearing that back I still struggle with anxiety.
Speaker 2:I still struggle sometimes. I don't know if it's depression or it's more anxiety. For me I don't think I'm really depressed, but I think it's easier to sort of face all of that and find the tools to calm myself down or without having the mind chatter of the alcohol which to me it became really loud of, like when's I wonder what I'm going to have to drink tonight, or what am I going to drink, like it was everything was planned around alcohol.
Speaker 2:And to eliminate that from my life has been really interesting, even to see who I gravitate towards as friends to who I don't know it's I just eliminating that entire aspect of my life has been so freeing and really I love it Like I find it very empowering to be able to go to a party and not even think about having a drink. Or be able to you know all the different. I mean, I used to plan a drink that went with almost every occasion right, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:And to just not have that as a part of it.
Speaker 1:Um has it impacted any of like your? You know you said then, I often found that when I speak to people when they give up alcohol, sometimes they might find that their friends aren't inviting them to things anymore or they maybe struggle to attend events because they don't have the comfort of alcohol, especially people with anxiety and you know I've talked about social anxiety in the past and people who need a drink to go to social events. But I often find that when alcohol is removed, some people they find that their friendship circles change because they're no longer being invited to things or they don't want to hang out with friends who are drinking. Did you experience anything like that or did things sort of stay the same for yourself?
Speaker 2:I did experience that, but I you know what. What I really saw was who, who are my lifelong friends and my friends that I consider family, and if I have a drink or if I don't have a drink, it doesn't matter within any situation. And I realized I'm very bored quickly, um, sitting around someone's counter with people just drinking. I don't find it that inspiring. And you know, at first I think it was like I put it on myself, like am I boring?
Speaker 2:do I not have enough to say, but then I realized no, this situation is boring it was much more fun when you was under the influence of alcohol now you're sober, you realize these situations aren't as fun as I thought they were yeah, I completely get that I think there's some people that, just like they may, they may you know when, when I did drink a lot, um, not a lot, but I it was a part of my life of every like almost every day and somebody would stop drinking. I remember thinking like, oh, they're probably not fun anymore. Yeah, yeah, that is the culprit?
Speaker 1:yeah, yeah. Well, that's what I mean, so it's one of the things at least you can understand it from. From another point of view, then, completely, um, do you know? What's interesting is reflecting on your past experience of alcohol, and particularly your ability to drink heavily and engage in risky behavior and I've got an example of it here, actually, because this is part of the social media post that I really enjoyed reading. You've put a relationship I had cultivated since I was 15 years old. I was a very good drinker. I could even do a keg stand for 53 seconds when I was 17. I could drive drunk in my 20s. I could be the last one standing at a party. I could climb over three-story balconies. I could car surf. I could do flips backwards downstairs and land on my feet. I was crazy good at drinking. Jesus Christ, how am I still alive? How do you view those moments now in light of your sobriety journey? What do you look back at that on?
Speaker 2:You know I look at it like we have so many different chapters in our lives. Um, recently I've just been transferring mini dv tapes from when I was younger. I have hundreds of them and I'm sort of I have to go very slowly and like look at small batches at a time because it steers up crazy emotions right to see yourself in your 20s and I just it's almost like that was another person um and it was a wild ride and I had a blast.
Speaker 2:I am surprised I'm still alive. I have a 15 year old little girl and I'm really hoping she's nothing like I was when you got children, you're like god.
Speaker 1:I hope they don't tell anything, like I was I don't think she will be no I either, who knows? She has her own journey coming up, yeah I mean we've you know, as part of the research. Um, I found out a little bits about your childhood and there's some things in there that you know we don't have to go into too much. But you're upbringing from what? Was it three to to 15 of your mother being in like a cult, was it?
Speaker 1:yeah so you know, obviously her child is going to be completely different to yours. I think was there a natural reason and you've probably discussed this before, but I guess, being in that environment was there a natural reason to feel rebellious because of coming from quite a religious background? Do you think that has anything to do with the behavior that you was portraying at? Do you know, 17 years old as you, as you've said, oh, I think 100%.
Speaker 2:You know, I was three to 15 when my mom left. I was just going into high school and I didn't really start rebelling until I was like 15 and experimenting and sort of finding my own identity, I guess. And yeah, it's been sort of a lifetime of unwiring and deprogramming whatever was instilled in my brain.
Speaker 1:That's a long time. They are really formative years of really kind of developing. Aren't they to go through that?
Speaker 2:And I never really bought into all of the stuff that they were feeding me because it didn't ring true for me what sort of stuff was they feeding you?
Speaker 1:because I've heard, I've heard, I've heard the stories of growing up in your mother being indoctrinated into a cult. But what sort of were the messages that you was being told at that young age?
Speaker 2:well, it was very, it was a very christian religious cult that was almost taking Christianity and then just like pushing it to the limits where you lose your identity and just wanting everybody to conform, and especially my mom and whatever you know, her, her, the people around her, and then they would trickle down to the kids and and I think my brother got more of the brunt of it than I did, because I was the youngest and I don't know it was.
Speaker 2:You know, it was just really fundamental. Like you're going to hell if you do that. Like I mean, this is too much information, but I, you go say whatever you want, so I mean as a small example, and know people grow up in religious families all the time.
Speaker 2:But I remember I think I was 10. And this is kind of embarrassing, but I decided to like look in the mirror and I figured out I had three holes. And I came running down the hallway Mom, I have three holes and she's, like you know, started yelling at me. You could go to hell for doing that. You can't look at yourself and you only have two. And I was like, no, no, there's definitely three. This lady has no idea what she's talking about. I was like something's off.
Speaker 1:How do you know more than an adult in that situation? You need to go take a look.
Speaker 2:There is not two Anyway, so it was things like that that I think that and if we had joy, if I remember being at school and doing gymnastics and feeling joy and proud, and another girl who was in the cult with me went home and told on me and I got reprimanded and and I was going to hell and I was, you know, I had to really I don't know what because I was um, oh my god, what was the word that we, I think I've blocked the word out. Whatever it was, you weren't. It was a sin to feel so much pride.
Speaker 1:Idolatry. I think yeah, yeah, I don't know whatever.
Speaker 2:But having said all of this, there's another component to whatever it was that influenced my relationship with alcohol. It was that my dad was an alcoholic.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:But when my mom was alive, I think she helped him keep it at bay and whatever it was, he didn't do it around us or in the house, um. But when she passed away was when he really sort of fell apart and I watched him for 15 to 20 years. Just see. Now I'm gonna cry, but just like lose himself. Oh my god. Okay, I didn't want to do that, but I'm just very emotionally.
Speaker 1:It makes me sad no, it's understandable, I think it's. It's, I guess, what I'm. To be fair, one of the things I'm more surprised about is is growing up in that environment and growing up with you know someone a father with alcohol dependence as well that you haven't experienced probably more trauma than you have to to be as functioning as you are and to have the success that you've dependence as well, that you haven't experienced probably more trauma than you have to be as functioning as you are and to have the success that you've had as well. From that, it's a question for you. Some people say that alcoholism is hereditary, that because their parents are alcohol dependent that's why I'm alcohol dependent. Oh, my dad was an alcoholic, that's why I'm an alcoholic. Do you have any opinion on that, as anyone of your brothers, sisters or anyone else who had any problems with alcohol as well, or my brother doesn't drink.
Speaker 2:My sister is a social drinker. Um, I do think a child of an alcoholic um creates a certain type of personality. Um, that is very good for to become a director nice I've actually michael ironside, who's a recovered alcoholic, did say that to me when he was on set of the space between um, he came over and while I was directing and running around the set, and he's like can I ask you, is your dad an alcoholic or is somebody? And I said yeah, my dad is.
Speaker 1:And he's like yeah, I feel like it suddenly made sense.
Speaker 2:There's so much about your personality that you suddenly still stop.
Speaker 1:Children of alcohol are great directors.
Speaker 2:That's brilliant, oh, okay, but I do think that is one of the reasons why I stopped drinking two years ago as well is that if I can get a handle on it now, great, because if in 20 years, when I don't feel great and my body's giving out, that's going to be harder than to get a handle on it, and did you actually believe that you would be going in the direction of alcohol addiction had you not made the changes that you've made over the last two years very slippery slope yeah, I think you know what it's.
Speaker 1:One of the things if you hadn't had the life that you've had and had the success that you've had and you know it very well could have been. Do you think something to do with your profile? The influence and your celebrity status is something that countered the possibility of becoming alcohol dependent early? I mean, I've met people as young as you know, in the 20s, with alcohol dependence. But what do you think to that? Maybe Because you've been so focused you know what I mean. Like you're looking at your career, you know there's often been something there that you've been, projects you've been working on.
Speaker 1:So I think one thing that I've often seen is people with the addiction mindset, whatever they turn their hand to, ends up being something quite significant, whether it be art I've seen some of the best art I've ever seen have been being from people who've had drug dependence because the challenge channeling that mindset and that addictive personality into something else because it's it's not necessarily the substance, that's the issue, it's that mindset in the way that um, yeah, the loop, and it's how they're making them feel. So I've known addicts go into into business and that's it. They're focused on their business like 24 7 and you end up making a crazy amount of money from it. But the second the business fails. That's it. They've gone into alcohol dependence or drug addiction because that's where their mindset is going yeah, so as you were saying all that, this something I was reminded me of.
Speaker 1:I think it was 29, 29, 30,.
Speaker 2:My mom had just passed away and I did get to a point with my drinking that I was scaring myself. And I remember talking to my boyfriend at the time, who was a really nice guy from Chicago, he was a musician and I said to him I'm scared, I think I need help, and you know I don't. Yeah, I think I need help, I'm not sure how, what to do. And he said to me he said it's a big choice. So either you get it in control right now or you can label yourself an alcoholic and go get the help, but you're an alcoholic for the rest of your life.
Speaker 2:And I remember I was like oh, that's so true, I'm just going to get it in control. And I did, I did.
Speaker 1:I did. You don't sound so sure I don't know.
Speaker 2:No, no, you know, because here I am 20 years later and I was like, oh my god, I need to stop drinking. And I finally hit the wall where I was like you know, my life right now is so lovely and nice. I have the nicest boyfriend. He's so kind, he he's so wonderful. I have a great daughter. I have my career starting to take off as a writer and a director and all this stuff, but something still felt off.
Speaker 2:And I remember sitting on my backyard with my pal Joanne, my my best drinking buddy, who's now a very good friend still um having my whiskey because I had stopped drinking wine, because it did not make me feel good. And I looked at her and I'm like, like I said, in that thing I got to blow something up. And I don't think it's Matt, I think it's this. And we were like okay, all right, so we just partied that day, and then it was like maybe a month later where.
Speaker 2:I just I was in Cannes, actually, and I just almost started to feel disconnected from my body. And I went to Cannes and I hadn't drank wine in over a year because it wasn't sitting well with me, and I decided that, since I was in France, I could have rosé. And I had one glass of rosé and I had one glass of rosé at a party and then I remember, before we were leaving that party I had poured, because they were pouring the smallest amounts of rosé.
Speaker 1:I was taking glasses of rosé and pouring it into my cup, so it was bigger and then I drank my producer making you a cup of tea, sort of thing, yeah, the half full. Yeah, yeah, exactly, but it was the rosé and I drank all that rosé. And then I drank my producer making you a cup of tea, sort of thing yeah, the half full.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, exactly, but it was the rose. And I drank all that rose and then I went out that night and I drank more. I drank myself to a point where I I couldn't even see straight laid on the beach all the next day, just so hungover, and then started to have panic, panic attacks the next day and then knew I had to fly. And then I remember saying to Matt on the phone and I said I think I need to stop drinking and I don't know how to do it, and he said I'll stop too yeah, so was that a big support, like having someone.
Speaker 2:Yeah so he stopped. He hasn't had a drink since and it was never a big deal to him, like it wasn't a part of his life, like it was mine. Especially I think a woman. I don't know everybody's different, but for me in my 40s, with my child young, that's like the drinking time.
Speaker 2:It's like you become it's a social thing with other mothers and all this stuff, and he stopped. And I do think it would have been so much harder Because if I had a partner who liked to make cozy meals and have a bottle of wine while we cook, and because that was like one of my favorite things to do was have someone cook, or or I would open up a bottle of wine if I was going to cook and and and just having that eliminated made it, I think, so much easier I don't know if matt drank, I don't know if I would have been able to do it yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, it's just having people around you. It's one of the things that I often speak to people with alcohol dependence and then I often say for them when it's like, oh, I'll give up, around Christmas time. And then Christmas comes and there's all the celebrations and actually, you know, drinks come with that. And then it's like, oh, maybe after Christmas. And then it gets to summertime and they're like, oh, maybe I'll have a drink in the summer. But the problem is there's never an ideal time to stop drinking because there's always going to be something For us. In the UK we have beer gardens, so once the sun comes out and it's not very often here, but once the sun is out, that's it People instantly turn, flock to the beer gardens and, you know, drink Christmas time, of course, there's naturally, you know, a lot of alcohol. So there's never really a good time to stop drinking because there's always going to be outside influence.
Speaker 1:So it's about dealing with that. And I think I mean when I speak to people who go to detox for alcohol dependence and I often say, once they get out, that's, you know, the detox was probably the easy part. Now you have to go to the supermarket and you have to see creators of beer on sale, bottles of wine on sale. That's where the temptation is Detox. You're safe In the rehab. You're safe. They don't have them pressures of it there. It's coming back into the community, which is hard, but again, going back to yourself. All it takes is to have a partner.
Speaker 2:Open up a bottle of wine, wine, the temptation is going to come creeping. So it's really good to have a supportive person in your life to do that alongside as well. 100. It's incredible that he, he, he did that for me. Pretty cool, um, and then. So still every now and then, like okay, here comes spring. Or when I walk into an airport about to go on a trip, I have, it's a wave that washes through me that's like, oh, what if I could be that social type of drinker that just every now and then I could have?
Speaker 2:yeah, but what but that? And that's a slippery slope that's it.
Speaker 1:It's that when you start going into the mindset of what if, and so many people especially, you know, will think after a year a certain thing oh it's nice, been a year now, maybe I can have the one. But for people, as you'll know, with alcoholism and alcohol addiction, there isn't just the one right.
Speaker 1:I always like the saying um, one's too many and two is not enough yeah it's a really good saying that yeah considering your background in the entertainment industry and your public persona, how have you navigated any pressures or expectations related to alcohol consumption or party culture?
Speaker 2:yeah, um, so I haven't been put into too many situations yet, especially since it was only two years ago coming right off the heels of COVID. You know so a little bit.
Speaker 1:you know, like when I've I guess, like movie premieres and stuff, it's often glamorized, people with champagne, you know those sort of events and functions.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I really haven't been in a lot of those situations recently. I mean, I have gone to a few things and that's not true. I've gone to a bunch of things and I just don't no, no, I just don't just as simple as that. Yeah, just yeah I just get my sparkling water in a wine glass and I and now I don't even bring it up the first year I felt the need to almost apologize for myself constantly and be like I don't drink anymore.
Speaker 2:And and then I dawned on me. Now I'm just telling, now I'm alienating myself right off the bat, nobody needs to know, and there's something about like sitting on the beach and having just a really cool beer, or just like. Even when I went to france and belgium a couple years ago with my daughter and my best friend, um, they had great non-alcoholic beers at the pub and that's all I needed was just one beer and it tastes good, that's it. You don't have two of them. No, no, of course and that's it.
Speaker 1:For me, it's often the taste. Once I've had the taste, I'm fine, because I've never liked the effects of being drunk not for a long time, to be fair, due to stupid stuff that I've done in my 20s like a lot of people, but I do. I really enjoy it, especially on a hot day. I really enjoy the taste of beer. So, coming home, opening a non-alcoholic beer from the fridge and sitting in my garden, I get the taste of it and then I'm fine and then the craving is gone and that's all I needed was just to get rid of the craving.
Speaker 1:So non-alcoholic beer for me personally has been wonderful. Yeah, me too. So for yourself, I guess to a lot of people you have been, you've been portrayed as, as a hero and a lot of people obviously their primary role is the pink power ranger. Uh, to millions of children worldwide. Um, does does that make it harder to be open and honest about personal issues and struggles? Because I found that to people when they're playing, I guess in a way I as a kid I used to look up to yourself and the rest of the power rangers as these invincible characters with no weaknesses. So to hear you come in and say about anxiety, it's like I never had imagined what's that like for you, kind of having that role and and being able to do you find that you're not able to be as honest. Is it harder to be open and honest about personal struggles because of that role?
Speaker 2:I'm just a very honest and open person anyway and I think because when I was struggling and I went online, searching andrew barrymore really was very inspiring to me and there's a couple canadian actresses that I was listening to and um that I think it could only be helpful. Just people just want to know that they're normal yeah and we're, we're all kind of we're all I, I don't know I I think we're all just trying to be okay yeah, this is I've never, never, true headspoken.
Speaker 1:I think you know. An interesting thing is I watched something with stan lee before and he talked a lot about heroes but he said you can having a hero with um. It's probably why I've never really resonated with the hero superman growing up, because he didn't seem to be. Obviously there was the kryptonite, but I can't relate to krypton. Do you know, as a kid I related to spiderman because his weakness was his loved ones and then being like the vulnerable part of it. So I think for me especially more as an adult, when I'm, you know, if I delve into graphic novels or comic books or superhero films the heroes having weaknesses are what make them heroes. It's triumphing over the weaknesses as well, like trying to know for the weaknesses as well. So I think in a way, for me that is that's an important thing to see people that you're looking up to expressing personal reasons as to things that they've got going on in life yeah, yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2:I just who just popped in my head was jdf yes yeah, and that that's tough a tough one because but was very, very open and verbal about all of his struggles. And you know I don't know if you ever saw any of he would do these poems and then he would like video these poems of his demons and his struggles that he was going through in his head and then you know, they won at some point and that's sad and that's hard and I think that really, really affected a lot of people.
Speaker 1:But yeah, yeah he struggled for a long time.
Speaker 1:I'm gonna come to jdf actually later in this this uh in this podcast because there is some things that I probably would like to to discuss. Well, I'm glad that. I'm glad that you've mentioned it, um, but I'd like to talk about the stigma and judgment from discussions around sobriety. It's obviously something that you said, you know. You used to have to feel like you needed to explain. Can you speak about the importance of removing the stigma and judgment from discussions about sobriety, especially in the context of your own experiences and I suppose the broader social convention? I mean, it's why we do this podcast. It's stigma, you know, it's about caring yeah, it's so funny.
Speaker 2:It's like I think I'm a lot. There's parts of me that are way more fun now than that, than they were before, but I think there is a stigma that you're not as fun. Um, I think a lot of people struggle with alcohol and they don't know that they're struggling with it.
Speaker 2:And so there is a judgment that comes up or there is a insecurity or something around it. If somebody doesn't need to drink and I think it could be slightly either either it's intimidating or they feel like that you're judging them or watching them, or there's something. There is a disconnect, and I have definitely in the last few years a lot of times felt like I'm on the outside of the conversation or the outside of the party.
Speaker 2:Not with everybody by any means, but with a lot of people. But then again, I I've always felt that my whole life, so I don't know if it is the alcohol or if it's just a general feeling I have gone through life with where do you think those feelings come from?
Speaker 1:from the cult, probably. Yeah, yeah, yeah, not being able to relate to other children or something.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because we went to public school, even though I was part of this religious church and cult and I had all the rules on me of like how I was dressed and just who we were, so I just always felt like an outcast because we went to the public school. So I think that's just like carried through and carried over.
Speaker 1:So it's a familiar feeling to feel like so you know, half the time, who knows, maybe when I am feeling that from people, it's my, it's my own stuff well, I think you know, when we use the word trauma, we instantly think of like, really you know severe things and obviously I don't know exactly. I mean, there was a lot of time to spend in a cult. But it's trauma is still that, in the sense of here, you are now still affected by things that happened to you as a child, as an adult. It still carries on in some way, doesn't it? There's always parts of you from, I think. As you said, I was speaking to my producer on the way down here.
Speaker 1:As you know, we had a seven, eight hour drive down here today to come and speak with you know we had a seven, eight hour drive down here today to come and speak with you, so we got into this conversation a lot. But it was interesting to talk about ourselves and how our I guess experiences that we experienced as kids, very young, still really inform our behaviours and how we are as adults and a lot of our life and how our relationships with our parents affect us as adults. And again, something that I saw, I read recently, should I say, is that we are, as soon as you become a parent, you are the ghost of your children's future, and I was like that's really powerful that to know that everything I'm doing and I don't I don't think it was necessarily the the case with my parents, or maybe they didn't think it too deep into it. I have a two-year-old daughter. I'm very conscious of how I'm going to raise her, to you know, and maybe overthinking to the point as well, thinking I have to get this right. Do you know what I mean? I don't want to uh offset some of my own anxieties onto her.
Speaker 1:Like, here's a stupid thing. I hate frogs. I'm terrified of frogs. When I see frogs, I just I freeze. We was walking along, we saw a frog. I couldn't let her see that daddy was scared of a frog. So I went over to that frog and got really close to it. I was like, look, it's Mr Frog. And I was like I can't let her see that. You know having these weaknesses and things like that. But there is something about that as a parent and how that affects us as adults as well, and I guess for yourself, do you know how was? I guess how was a child's experiences affecting you as an adult is maybe quite visible as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't know. The other day I was sort of going through an anxiety sort of thing and I was talking to this mentor that I have this guy Robert, and I was like this just feels so familiar.
Speaker 2:Like here I am again and I was like. This just feels so familiar, like here I am again and he goes. But if you actually look at it, look how much you've evolved and changed from when you were in your thirties, maybe going through similar feelings of trauma, of residual stuff from your childhood. And he's so right, because I am so much happier than I was in my mid-30s when I fled Los Angeles and moved my life to Montreal and sort of had a little bit of a nervous breakdown. But that doesn't mean we're humans. We're never going to feel perfect, we're always. I think all of that stuff will keep coming up, but we keep evolving and growing, hopefully as people that more equipped to kind of deal with the the waves as they come was the move to montreal.
Speaker 1:Um, did you find that you was trying to escape something? Was that the reason for the move? So a lot of people completely relocate the lives? Because it does, I guess in a way it's. It's, if I move away from where I think the problem is, I'm getting away from the problem, and then they find that they move and go hang on, the problems come with me because I'm the problem. Do you know what I mean? So did you experience that? Was that part of the reason why you made the move? And if so, what was it you was maybe escaping from?
Speaker 2:if you won't mind discussing, I needed to leave LA because I had come to a point where I think I had spent too much of my 20s and my early 30s comparing myself to other people. And it was debilitating and my mother had passed away maybe five years before that and I I don't think I had actually walked through that grief yet and so I needed to go fall apart and do that, because I was still working constantly the whole time and no time to grieve.
Speaker 2:You need that time to process a loss like that process and grieve and then also get a start, a new habit of not comparing myself to other people and I find I found being an actress in los angeles and hollywood. All I was doing was looking at what everybody else had and I needed to just stop yeah, and, and that's to be fair.
Speaker 1:The interesting thing about that is it's rife in the world now, because of social media, people are constantly comparing themselves to other people and in social media, do you, do you find that you?
Speaker 2:have that now, or are you past that point of comparing and I delete social media off my phone a lot and then I have to put it back on because for work and for what I'm doing to promote, say, the comic book or a convention I'm going to, or you know, it's just I think it's part of my work at my career at this point.
Speaker 2:Um, I go back on and I do my thing and then I find myself, as soon as there is one afternoon, where I lay down and just start scrolling and 15 minutes have gone by, or 20 minutes or a half hour, and I feel sick to my stomach. I delete it, yeah.
Speaker 1:I have app timers on my phone now so I can't access between. You know, across all platforms, I technically have one hour of social media a day. That's not one hour of Instagram, twitter. It's all of them at once. If I hit an hour on Instagram, I'm not allowed on Twitter. My phone won't let me. I could go in and change the settings, but it's a little prompt for me. When I know it, I'm like, oh, or even if the timer comes up, you have 10 minutes. I've probably spent too much time on this today. I find that really helpful because I have been guilty of comparing myself to others, I think, in the past, and I think it's quite a normal thing to do and it's as you've said, it's quite depressing in a weird way.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's just, it's not real.
Speaker 1:Exactly. It's not real. I guess that's the thing that I really have to hammer. I was like that's not real. That is not what it looks like it's, it's a complete facade yeah do you think that was going on for yourself in reality as well? In la, you know, when you said you was comparing yourself to other people yes yeah, so it wasn't like in social media. It's also no, no, no, that's what I mean.
Speaker 2:So to do it in person in person in my career and who people who seem like they were more in love, who had boyfriends, and like I've really found in the last five years that I've been with Matt, who's my boyfriend, I finally finally like he's just the sweetest, nicest guy. He's like you know, I feel so lucky to have found somebody. I think before Matt may have never been a person that I would be with because I don't know what I was thinking Like I need this or that, or I have to be with somebody that I put on a pedestal, and then finally I'm just with somebody who I just feel really comfortable around and he makes me feel pretty, or I just feel pretty around him or I just feel calm.
Speaker 2:He's a very calm person and I would say only in the last year have I really been like grateful for that and I am not settling like in my head five years ago oh, that would be settling. Now I don't even know why I'm settling for what like? What did I have in my head?
Speaker 1:what was out there?
Speaker 2:nothing that whatever that was doesn't even exist.
Speaker 1:It's nice when you've got someone that is so, so calm and you know to to be. I mean, I found it since having my daughter. It gets to the to the weekends now and like sometimes I don't want to go socializing with friends and stuff, like I'm happy, just me, my wife, my daughter, just in this little nook sort of thing doing. We don't have to do anything even remotely like exciting, we can go walk the dogs on a field somewhere and I'm like this is perfect, I'm happy. You know, this is what I want. And it's so interesting to be in that position where you feel like, where someone does make you feel safe and you're not bothered about the outside world and you're not worrying about social media and all those things. I think it's a really nice place to be I used to love to travel alone and I would just go everywhere to in.
Speaker 2:When I got here a couple days early, before David got here and before my friend Taya came, I had a whole day to myself and I finished the day. I mean, I went and I traveled around and stuff, and I called Matt and I'm like, yeah, I'm just really not into this anymore.
Speaker 1:Like life's about communion and being with people and and sharing moments with the people that you love do you find it hard to be away from him then, like now, like you know, coming here for work as you are, is that being quite hard for you, or has it been okay?
Speaker 2:no, no, like we're so independent yeah I prefer that he was here because that's more fun. I preferred when david actually arrived and was here. I didn't need to come a day alone, although. I think I needed it for the jet lag yeah and I did enjoy myself, but I wish I had a pal like I'd rather travel with a friend, but it has to do with that right.
Speaker 1:Just yeah, absolutely so. Your personal connections to the themes of addiction and mental health in your previous directorial effort, tammy's Always Dying, is evident. How did you manage the emotional toll of revisiting these experiences while working on the film, both as a director and as someone who has lived through similar circumstances as well?
Speaker 2:so Tammy's Always Dying was written by a very good friend of mine named Joanne Sarazin, that I met at school at the director's program at the Canadian Film Centre and she did a reading of her script and I couldn't even get out of my chair when I was done. I mean first of all, I laughed throughout the whole thing because, it's the saddest, funniest script that I've ever seen.
Speaker 2:And then I walked up to her just in tears, sobbing, and I think it just struck something in me, because my dad at that time was tammy, basically like my dad got to a point um before he went into a home where he spent the last three years of his life, um where his alcoholism had completely taken over, where by I'd say, 10 am he would be passed out in bed because he woke up at 8 am and or 6 am and started drinking vodka straight he at one point he moved into the bathroom and was like um, can we set up a tv in here? My dad, as bad as it got, has always been the quirkiest, funniest person.
Speaker 2:I think very inappropriate though person I've ever met, so there's a lot of sad humor that went along with my father and who he was, the last 15 years of his life when alcoholism really took hold, the last 15 years of his life when alcoholism really took hold. Um, and this script, just I felt like it was a really great cathartic way to explore what my dad was going through without making a movie about my dad yeah, that's I guess that's a nice way of putting it, really isn't.
Speaker 2:It is having that um insight and that perspective without necessarily having to delve into, to reveal too much of your own personal circumstances or his or his exactly respecting his privacy as well, absolutely yeah yeah, it was interesting because when that movie was coming out at tiff a reporter asked me if I I they could have his phone number because I had mentioned something. And I said okay and they called him Really and he answered the phone and he was so excited to talk about it.
Speaker 1:Wow.
Speaker 2:And he was very honest and he said what his struggles were and yeah, like he wasn't. I mean, the last three years he was in a home that was actually a rehabilitation center upstairs and then like an old folks home downstairs and my brother had miraculously got him a bed there because my brother was the night security guard I mean you can't even write, and my dad would, um, at first be like sneaking out the window and and they would find him down the street at the packy, you know, get in a bottle, and or they would find him out in the woods smoking his cigarettes.
Speaker 2:And I mean even, I think the last six months, all of a sudden, like he would be drunk, and they're like how can he be drunk?
Speaker 2:he was, he was a used car dealer too, so he would like he had schmoozed somebody and somebody was like bringing him alcohol and giving it to him through the window and giving it to him through the window, but I think that that's okay, because it made him really happy, his mischievous, like he was never going to change right, and so he felt alive because he was still being that crazy wild guy he was when he was in his 20s.
Speaker 1:I liked hearing the story that you said um on a previous podcast where you said your, your dad, had said that your brother didn't make a good car salesman because he was too honest. Yep, I love that, like the openness that you know to me. He's car salesman. You've got a lie, you know.
Speaker 2:I love that yeah, my brother is one of the nicest people in the world. He's actually one of the like managers or whatever of the um the home that my dad was living at. Yeah, it became a big part of his life. Good, that's cool.
Speaker 1:Some people watch this and see your success. You know you've worked with, obviously, saban, bandai, hasbro, fox, there's Funko Pops, boom Studios, thq, sega, capcom, walmart, toys R Us. Of course you know Netflix. All have taken your likeness and projected it into hundreds of millions of homes through extensive merchandising and marketing efforts, including Toylands, video games, clothing accessories, television shows, books, comics and, of course, the summer blockbuster movie. That is a reach that not many people on this planet have experienced, but you perhaps. I guess what people aren't aware of are the struggles that you faced outside of the limelight. Can you describe to me your absolute rock bottom moment?
Speaker 2:That would definitely be. When I moved to Montreal and and I left my, I mean I literally put everything on a truck and moved it all out.
Speaker 2:I just left LA, I just left and I got to Montreal and I literally fell apart emotionally and I was so afraid of falling apart because I didn't know what would happen if I did hit bottom. Because I didn't know what would happen if I did hit bottom. And then I found a mentor-type person to sort of be there for me. He lived in New York and so I would talk to him almost like a therapist, a little bit more spiritual, and he sort of just guided me to the bottom. I think I needed to hit it.
Speaker 2:I needed to hit it to know that I wasn't going to die or I wasn't going to go crazy. That was always a fear like am I going crazy, am I going crazy? And you know, every time I feel that somebody who's guiding me or helping me will say people who go crazy don't know they're going crazy yeah, yeah, that's true I feel better.
Speaker 1:So what was it specifically? So moving to? I mean moving to montreal, that sounds great. Do you know what I mean? So what was?
Speaker 2:it about. I bought a little bicycle and I would ride around and I would get my bottles of wine and I would like sit there and smoke my cigarettes and and so what?
Speaker 1:what was it? What was it that was the actual rock bottom moment then, that caused them? I guess, what was it that caused the move to montreal? Do you know what? What are all the things where you really just thought you know what?
Speaker 2:I mean the bottom was after I got to montreal, meaning mentally the bottom of where I would lay in my bathtub with the water just spraying down on me, trying to make the world stop, like trying it was, everything would spin it just felt like the world was spinning and spinning and spinning so fast and I would just have to lay there and like I would try to stop the spin that's how I, like, could describe it then and um, I think it was grief, I think it was getting off the train I used to call it the hollywood train of of this quest for fame of this quest for what, where I thought I wanted to go and like just kind of rediscovering and reconnecting with who I am and and getting to know myself.
Speaker 2:And then I ended up getting a tv series in Toronto and that brought me to Toronto where I did a cop show called Flashpoint and it was through that show that I did find my confidence and I did find myself again and I discovered I liked writing and directing was it, would you?
Speaker 1:would you say it was the loss of your mother. Then, when you say about processing grief, what was the distance between losing your mother and moving to Montreal? Was it a quick thing, like you lost your mother and moved to Montreal pretty quickly?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think I was a different person before my mom died. That really rocked my world. It was like that just changed everything. Um, so she died when I was 28 and I moved to montreal when I was turning 35 oh wow, so there's a.
Speaker 1:There's about seven years of floundering around and just um that's a long time, seven years really unhappy, really just disconnected and like just trying to be okay what did those seven years look like on on a, I guess, on a daily basis for you? What was happening in that time?
Speaker 2:um was you working. I ended up getting a.
Speaker 2:Well, I got off felicity I asked to leave because it wasn't working for me emotionally at the moment. I went to Chicago. I did a rock album. I then auditioned no, I didn't have a real audition. They offered me Love Janice off Broadway where I played Janice Joplin, which was insane 18 songs, whatever. I dove into Janice Joplin in New York City. I started just drinking, like you know, bourbon and like, and then I did the show. I mean, I don't want to. I don't want to make a try to make this shorter than it possibly is. The night before my opening of Love Jan, somebody broke into my new york apartment and was like standing over my head. It was so, so scary and he just wanted to steal my computer. But that happened was it targeted?
Speaker 1:did he know who you was, or was it just a random broken?
Speaker 2:I believe I was targeted because I had bought furniture from the salvation army down the street and they moved the furniture in and outside my window was a little white piece of chalk and the window was open anyway he didn't hurt me, he just stole my computer.
Speaker 2:But that was scary. And then I got fired from Love Janice, and then I had embodied Janice Joplin, and then I didn't know what to do. So then I went to Bosnia and then, anyway, it was a whole stream. And then my best friend got in a car accident and died, and then it was just like it was just a mirriade of one things after another.
Speaker 1:What did you get fired from as Janis Joplin for?
Speaker 2:I've never really known. It was me and who sang Gloria.
Speaker 1:Oh, it was.
Speaker 2:Was that Laura Branigan or Linda?
Speaker 1:Ronstadt, no Branigan.
Speaker 2:So me and Laura Branigan were playing Janice, because it was 18 shows, we had to split it. We both got let go like two days after, so I don't have no idea what happened really underneath it all, I think they ended. I don't have no idea what happened really underneath it all. I think they ended up. I had no idea, but that was like it's gonna hurt, isn't it?
Speaker 2:I guess getting fired from any role is gonna, and I had gotten a residency, playing my guitar at the bitter end, right across the street from the theater, and so for like three months after that, I would still have to keep seeing the posters and the place. I then get on stage. But it was like a couple years there and then jay died and then I just, yeah, I was with the wrong guy. The boyfriend like cheated on me blah blah, blah, blah and then finally I'm like I gotta get out of here.
Speaker 1:And then I just drove cross-country and ended up in Montreal do you think playing a character like Janice Joplin had any impact on on your drinking, because obviously she was such a influential figure in that?
Speaker 2:I became Janice exactly. Do you know what I mean? What do you call it method acting? That's it nowhere to actually exercise?
Speaker 1:to channel it into. Yeah, yeah, that's it, because that's a lot to take on as a character like that, and then nowhere to nowhere to channel it into it was really intense. Yeah, I can imagine, I can imagine that being quite an intense role to take on, from a method acting point of view as well, to really throw yourself into that, I mean.
Speaker 2:I felt for mannerisms and everything, I just remember sitting in my tub, like with a bottle of bourbon, smoking cigarettes, and I'm like I'm really gonna be whatever. I got fired.
Speaker 1:All that, all that for nothing it didn't work out and yeah and then I had nowhere to put it. So that's when I went to bosnia that was like my third time going there, but just went and traveled alone for like a month and met up with people and is that like a safe space for you, bosnia, to go back that many times and often like, as you said, when, at quite low moments, quite low moments. What is it for you in Bosnia that you do find comforting?
Speaker 2:A lot of it is the people that I had met that I just found what they had gone through was so much more than I was going through. And I thought there was a comfort in that for some reason, and my connection with them. I feel like I have a couple soul sisters from there, like we're just really close.
Speaker 1:It's a weird one, isn't it that, like, um, obviously I work for a, working for a substance, misuse, charity sometimes I get low feelings of anxiety, depression, and then I spend time at work and I'll be chatting to people who really are at their rock bottom moments and in a weird way, I think, why am I sad, why am I worried? You know, like, look, what these people are dealing with, what I'm dealing with is nothing compared to what they're going through and it sounds quite twisted in a way that it actually makes me, you know, feel a little bit more comfortable with what I'm dealing with and think, you know, thank God I'm not dealing with something heavier than this and it's strange to be in that position. And I guess that's kind of what you're experiencing when you go to Bosnia is a similar thing. It reminds me of this scene in Fight Club.
Speaker 1:The guy goes to all those meetings and he said it's because he has insomnia and it's the only way he can sleep at night is by listening to other people's stories and what they're going through, and he's kind of pretending to be part of these circles, like these alcoholic anonymous, and he goes to like a cancer meeting for cancer, you know patients and it's.
Speaker 1:The only way he can get to sleep at night is listening to people who are worse off than him, which is a rather twisted way of seeing it, but there is a weird way of, I guess, finding I don't know I don't want to say comfort because it's not comfort, but there's something about listening to other people who are in worse positions where you do re-evaluate your own life and think do you know what? I'm going to be okay If this guy is okay dealing with this and she's okay after dealing with that. I'm going to be okay dealing with this, because this isn't even a fraction of what this person is dealing with and they're surviving, they're making it. Do you know what I mean? So there is something in that as well. I don't know if that resonates with with yourself or anything?
Speaker 2:yeah, it does.
Speaker 1:I also think everything is relative exactly that's the one thing I often so some people say to me it's like you shouldn't, because if you did that you'd look at third world countries and think you know everyone technically lives in the uk or usa should never experience depression because we're not a third world country do you? Know, but it is relative.
Speaker 2:It's relative to our own experiences, so yes, that first camp I went to in 98 um. It was so interesting because it was these little. It was in baria, which was in a little island off of croatia, and these boats would pull up with all of these kids from different sides of the war, some from Croatia, some from Bosnia, some from Serbia, and they were all afraid of each other when it started and they couldn't even sleep at night and the camp was just basically to come and play and play music and be with each other and to mend some of those relationships or feelings towards each other and by the end end.
Speaker 2:It was really interesting to watch these kids suddenly there aren't, their walls come down, they become friends and by the end they're bickering and fighting over a toy or something and it was like, and that was like, it all becomes relative.
Speaker 1:Yeah, in the moment, you know, I like that as well, and that's a really good thing that they don't as doing that with children, so they don't grow up resenting people from other places. I think, I think that's really, it's really nice. So what? What a great idea. What, how much foresight is is there to to do a camp like that? That's incredible, actually. Whoever came up with that idea? That's an. That is a genius really judith, judith, jenya yeah it was called the global children's camp.
Speaker 1:It was pretty cool there's some, that's a real no, but people don't have that level of foresight. Do you know what I mean? So to hear that that is absolutely incredible. I'm going to talk about your decision to pursue filmmaking and how that has allowed you to explore deeply personal subjects, including your own family history. Do you know we've always talked about this, actually, but you've published it that your father is a non-functional alcoholic, and you've said about the cathartic aspect of storytelling and how that helped you process your own experiences as well? I guess, to be fair, I've wrote this out, but we've kind of already talked about it a little bit. I don't know if to delve into it a little bit more, but talk about that cathartic experience to do tammy's always Dying to have the idea of your father in mind, of this story and this character. Talk to me about the cathartic experience that you experienced by channeling these personal stories into this artwork that you're creating in these films.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, like I said before, I was just really drawn to that script and I asked the writer can I make this movie? And she thought about it and then she said, yeah, I'm going to trust you to do that. And then we had Felicity Huffman. We got her, she read the script and she just got very connected for her own reasons to the story.
Speaker 2:So that was a huge win because it was a tiny little movie in Canada and she flew out to do this and and it was wild and it was fun and it was, it was crazy and I mean we shot that movie in 17 days and just I loved every second of it and it was very interesting because Matt actually my boyfriend was my first AD and you know I worked very closely with the production designer and the DP and just mapped out this movie and I was 100 miles per hour. I had to be away from my daughter for that month. I think she came to visit twice and I was so in it and it was the last day of shooting and we just finished and we walked. Matt looked at me and he could tell I was either about to pass out or something was happening and he goes do you need a minute?
Speaker 2:and I was like yes, and so he took me and he brought me into this little side room where nobody was and I sat on the floor and I sobbed. I just like gutturally sobbed, like a grieving, like crying, and Matt just sat down beside me and put his hand on my shoulder and I just probably at least a good 20 minutes, just cried and it was like I don't even know, I don't know. It's like I had to hold myself together because for the whole shoot, because I'm the director and I can't be crying while everybody's shooting the stuff you know what I mean?
Speaker 2:it was just like we're just making this movie, we're doing this thing, but what we were making was pretty freaking heavy. It was some heavy stuff happening and yeah, I don't even know how to answer that question, but I know that it was some heavy stuff happening and, yeah, I don't even know how to answer that question, but I know that it was um a very cathartic experience for me.
Speaker 1:Do you think there's something in there with you know, talking about, I guess, your life and your childhood? I mean in a way that to me that sounds like a movie in itself. Young girl in a cult until the age of 15. I wrote it, yeah.
Speaker 2:It's written. It's called Crazier Than you, which is something that my mom said to my dad when she was like 21. Because they met when she was 17. My dad, after they had three kids, would leave and go out drinking for the weekend, and she ended up getting saved watching television. And then she joined a gym a gym my dad called it a gym.
Speaker 2:For 12 years she joined a church and the pastor from that church went and moved to another church where all the ladies followed, and then that was the cult, and so I do have that script in my back pocket but, it's funny because when I got my manager who I love his name is Jeff and I sent him Crazier Than you after, because he saw Tammy Tammy's always dying at TIFF read Crazier Than you, he goes. I think you already made this movie, or at least a version of it for now and I was like yeah, yeah, you're right so. I have that one on the side. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:I think it's to be fair when I hear about your story and growing up in the cult and leaving to go to LA and correct me if I'm wrong, but it wasn't long that you was in LA before you got picked up for the Power Ranger series, was it?
Speaker 2:My first audition.
Speaker 1:I was there for six months though. Okay, yeah, but it's that's still an incredibly short time to be picked up and to do something that, again, is is known over the world do you know exactly and and there's something about that and then going through that experience to what you're doing now is around and it's just.
Speaker 1:It's a movie in itself, isn't it like the entire story almost sounds unbelievable. If someone told me your life story but didn't tell me it was you, I would feel like they're telling me the plot of a of a of a hollywood film oh, I don't know, I remember it's because it's normal to you. That's just your life, isn't it? But to me I'm like wow, that's, that's insane, that's crazy, that's that sounds entertaining. It's got its low moments, it's high moments, it just sounds.
Speaker 2:It sounds wild I remember when I was trying to decide if I moved to montreal or not, or if I get out of los angeles and I was walking with a friend in boston because we were they I had shot a movie in maine anyway, it doesn't matter where I was or what was happening, but his name was ian, he was the director of the movie and I was telling him I was kind of going through this crossroads and I'm like I don't, I kind of want to just move to Montreal, but that's crazy just to move my whole life.
Speaker 2:Why?
Speaker 1:Montreal. Why that specific place? I did a movie there and they spoke French and I thought it was cool. I was like what is this?
Speaker 2:I kind of want to move to Europe, but that's far.
Speaker 1:So why don't I move?
Speaker 2:here and Ian said to me well, you know, I like to make decisions based on like, at the end of your life, if you look back, what's the most interesting? And I was like, oh, I like that. Well, that's pretty interesting. If I move to Montreal, I'm going to do that one.
Speaker 1:That's incredible. Do you know what? That's a sad question here, but I have to ask your dad and your mom's relationship. Do you know, obviously they were together up until your mother passed away. What was relationship? Do you know, obviously, that there was together up until your mother passed away? What was his opinion on on the cult and and how? I mean, I kind of had the impression at first that your dad was just part of it as well, but it sounds like he was completely oblivious to it in some respect yeah, no, that was the gym that she joined for 12 years.
Speaker 2:Literally is how we viewed it like that's just, that's just her thing.
Speaker 1:Like, let it, let her go to that gym how did I just can't imagine my, my wife, joining the cult and me not really knowing, or it being a huge part of my life as well.
Speaker 2:Oh, he knew and it was it wasn't a part of his life, like he would go there for christmas and or or whatever it was, but, um, it really at the end, when my mother left, they decided to tell all those ladies that they weren't allowed to, um, to give blowjobs.
Speaker 1:Okay and that's when your dad was like no, this is it, I've had enough of this cult my dad put his foot down, then he's like that's crazy I like after 12 years. That's the thing where you don't say the numbers.
Speaker 2:No blowjobs, no collagen Wow, that's true, yeah, and then it made my mother sort of wonder and be like that is kind of crazy.
Speaker 1:That's the moment where your mum questioned 12 years of being in a religious cult.
Speaker 2:Crazy, isn't it? It's kind of a comedy.
Speaker 1:I can see it now. That is absolutely wonderful. I love that.
Speaker 2:I know.
Speaker 1:That is crazy. I love it. Slight change of topic You've mentioned him already, but I'd like to talk about jason david frank. So, given the fact that you know we, you know we've talked about, I guess addiction and and mental health issues go hand in hand here. I've got a quote from you here where you put I hope anyone out there who is feeling helpless or has no hope, depressed, lost or sad, then please reach out for help. There is help. You have a community here. Can you perhaps discuss the community, the, the impact that Jason had on your life, and whether you feel a level of responsibility to use your profile and influence to address the stigma that is associated with mental health?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't know. I've never really thought about that a lot, really Like honestly. When I posted that or I went on and saying I just remember jason passed on a saturday, great like crazy shock all through sunday, and I knew that I need to go say something. I knew that he meant so much to so many people and I didn't know when I would. I'm a very impulsive person and a go-on instinct and I didn't know when that was going to be or what it was going to be. And it was literally that Monday morning where I just I love to play my piano and I love to sing and I sat down to sing and play and, without even thinking, just pressed live and just just almost kind of needed them as much as they needed me in that moment.
Speaker 2:It was like just to acknowledge this loud, beautiful presence that is gone like just in such a blink.
Speaker 1:It's like I guess people instantly do look to when something like that happens. It was like when Matthew Perry passed away, people instantly was looking to what was the response from the cast of Friends, and then it was coming under fire because they hadn't said something almost immediately and it was like, look, they need to process these things in their own time and say things in their own time, and I guess it was a similar situation. Uh, do you know for yourself? But when, when jason passed away people's thing you know I was kind of wondering do you know what? What's amy joe's response to this gonna be? What's david yost's response to this gonna be? It was quite interesting to that's sort of weirdly enough. That's the sort of things you look out for when something like that happens. I guess people would have been really interested to hear what you had to say on it, and I guess did you. Did you feel like you had a responsibility to say something? Do you know what was that like for you?
Speaker 2:it could have been a feeling of responsibility, but it felt I wouldn't even say it felt like that it just it felt. I wouldn't even say it felt like that.
Speaker 1:It just, it felt natural to to.
Speaker 2:I felt like I had to, it felt like it just felt like I don't even know how to explain it. I just was like I just have to do this.
Speaker 1:Like.
Speaker 2:I just I need to do this. I just I, I know I mean one of the things that Jason was just so like we talked about a little bit earlier so verbal about and just so was mental health and was trying to help people and that was like his mission, because he struggled so much for so long, was he?
Speaker 1:open about his struggles with you and other friends with his mental health? Or was it something that he did quite close to his chest? Because, again think, because of stigma some men it's quite a stereotypical thing to say, but the idea for men and I speaking for myself sometimes it's nobody cares, you're a man, just get on with it. And I don't know if that was something that he experienced or if he was more open to it with with friends like yourself.
Speaker 2:I think, think Jason was a very private person at the same time, very generous and open as well. I think he had an ability to make a lot of people feel very special and make a lot of people feel like they were one of the closest people to him as well and we had conversations throughout the years.
Speaker 2:he would bring it up that he, you know, was struggling, but he would always be like but I'm okay, but I'm okay, but I'm okay and you know his brother had committed suicide and he had a lot of tragedy in his life around that and for whatever reason I don't know, in that last year. Uh, yeah, I I'm not sure what happened fully or where he went or what happened, but yeah because he's.
Speaker 1:he's obviously someone that was very associated with the the power rangers franchise and not to say that you, the rest of the cast and yourself, have distanced yourself from it, but he did a lot of like spin-off series. I remember watching some of the Green Ranger versus Rai you were from Street Fighter or something.
Speaker 2:He really loved the series. My favorite is my Morphin' Life. Did you ever watch any?
Speaker 1:of that. Do you know you've seen my Morphin' Life, haven't you? I haven life. Did you ever watch it?
Speaker 2:you know, you've seen my morph in life, haven't you? I haven't seen it yet. Hilarious yeah, I think he's one of the funniest people that ever lived, like his whole poop thing in the toilet do you remember that?
Speaker 1:what was in the toilet.
Speaker 2:Was it a poop? Yeah, it would make me laugh so hard. He was just really funny, um, and, and that was his morph in life and Power Rangers was such a big deal to him, like it really, really really was. Like. I think that he and David has said this too Like a lot of people have said this I think he is one of the reasons why that franchise lasted for so long.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Even with the Comic-Cons, even with all that Like it was his life, why that franchise lasted for so long. Yeah, even with the comic cons, even with all that like he it was, it was his life. And I tell you, um covid, I think really affected him very negatively and I think that was really, really, really hard for him when he couldn't do the conventions and he couldn't be like. He got on his motorcycle and started driving to comic book shops because he needed that connection that's.
Speaker 1:it's interesting that and and there's probably something deep in there and he didn't drink right.
Speaker 2:So he had the personality of an addict and he knew he couldn't drink and in that last year he was.
Speaker 1:This is the kind of what we're saying about throwing yourself into something or going all in something creatively, whether it be substances, or it's about what you're getting out of it and I guess, in a way, from the outside in. That was kind of the impression that you got with with jason david frank and the power rangers franchise, like how all in he was, like I mean, I remember seeing things and I don't know what's happening with I'm sure there's there's updates out there the legend of the white dragon that he was in the middle of uh being, you know, a huge part of. I don't know if that film's ever going to come out. I don't know what the plan is for it.
Speaker 2:I hope it does for Jenna's sake, exactly yeah.
Speaker 1:It'd be really nice to see something like that with him still in so. I don't know where there was in terms of production. But back to you, I guess. My last question, if you really is, what's next, as you continue to explore through storytelling, through comics and filmmaking, what are your aspirations for the impact of your work, both personally and within the broader cultural landscape? Obviously you've recently gotten to uh writing comic series, which is great to see you obviously be back to the franchise in some capacity.
Speaker 2:It's really fun to go back in a way that I'm passionate about and I love, which is writing. So yeah, the, the MMPR, the Return, has been such a you know it's a love letter to all the kids who are now adults, but it's as much, just sort of like I don't even know how to explain it. I just I've loved revisiting the whole entire. I mean, I watched the shows for the first time. I hadn't even seen them as an actor.
Speaker 1:Oh really, I never watched anything. I was in.
Speaker 2:I was too insecure, but now as a director it's a different thing, that's interesting though. So that was fun because we wanted to find a jumping off point of where the story would begin. And then doing it with my boyfriend Matt has been really cool and a challenge, and figuring out how to write together and work together. And we're dreaming up the sequel right now. We haven't told Boom yet but we have it.
Speaker 2:So that'll be fun, just to keep exploring the comic book world, which is a really cool way to have something come to fruition a bit faster than making a movie which takes forever.
Speaker 1:Yeah, kind of much. Yeah, fruition a bit faster than making a movie which takes forever.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because I have two movies, two, two screenplays that I wrote. One is a love story called ends of the earth and one is a thriller called um what we become, and both of them have producers now, both of them are casting and so hopefully in the next two years I'll have these two movies to uh put out there and show people what I can do in that regard, because I wrote these I didn't write to him, he's always dying.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:So that's really nice to do a lot yeah um, I have an ep coming out called still here oh nice and it's uh, right now it's three songs. I have eight songs written, but three songs have been recorded fully. My friend Nick Marzock is the producer and they're about still being here and perseverance and life, and those will be coming out. I have to make a release date, but they just finished getting mastered and so they're coming soon. And yeah, you know what I I like rotate around my house, I have my piano station.
Speaker 1:It's gonna say it's like you've got so much on you know it's jumping from one thing to another. I imagine that's quite difficult, I guess. But no, do you find it easy? I have to jump from writing to music like if I like.
Speaker 2:the other day I was so sick of being at my computer writing and writing and screenplays that I just was like, oh, oh right, there's the piano.
Speaker 1:And I just sit down and start banging on the piano and singing and and then writing the comic books and I, yeah it's.
Speaker 2:And then I have my website, amyjojohnsoncom, and on there I sort of like I don't update it as much as I should, but I try to keep up to date with like things that are happening.
Speaker 1:I think, like you said, with your relationship with social media, it all ties in, doesn't it? I guess really is having that pressure to constantly give updates really is. Is is having that pressure to to constantly give updates, and I guess that's the weird thing about social media now is people expect updates like daily off people that they follow and if they don't upload in x amount of time then they're inactive and it's like no man, we've just got other stuff going on, you know yeah, you have to like fill your tank and only just.
Speaker 2:I highly recommend everybody in the world to limit themselves on social media. I think it's so.
Speaker 1:It's one of the best things that I did for my personal mental health, really was to limit myself on social media. I feel much better and much more productive in other areas as well.
Speaker 2:It's a vortex, it is. Yeah, we have to end on a positive note, though.
Speaker 1:We do To be fair. We will end on a positive note, because I have a series of 10 questions that I like to ask all my guests at the end of it Quick fire questions. So my first question is what is your favorite word?
Speaker 2:Manifest.
Speaker 1:What's your least favorite word?
Speaker 2:I almost said poop.
Speaker 1:Tell me something that excites you.
Speaker 2:Family.
Speaker 1:Tell me something that doesn't excite you.
Speaker 2:Social media.
Speaker 1:What sound or noise do you?
Speaker 2:love Francesca laughing.
Speaker 1:A sound or noise that you hate Fighting. What's your favourite curse word? Fuck Nice. What profession or job would you like to attempt?
Speaker 2:I love writing and directing.
Speaker 1:I just want to do it more um, and then my last question for you is if god exists, what would you like to hear when you arrive at the pearly gates? Well done I want to change my poop word, I'll ask it again.
Speaker 2:Go on, then, hang on, let's go again, imjo yeah.
Speaker 1:What is?
Speaker 2:your least favourite word. I don't have one. Hold on, I've got to think of one. My least favourite word Poop no.
Speaker 1:And if you've enjoyed this episode of the Believe in People podcast, then please check out our other episodes and hit that subscribe button. You can also find clips, outtakes and extras from this series on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter and YouTube. At CGLHull, that's at C-G-L-H-U-L-L. We're on Apple Music, Spotify, Google and YouTube Music, so please like and subscribe to be notified about new episodes. You can also search for Believe in People Podcast on your favourite listening device and, if you can leave us a review, that will really help us in getting our message out there and rising up the daily podcast charts.
